The Student Loan Podcast Intro (00:00): Welcome to the student loan podcast. Here, you'll find practical advice on tackling student loan debt, paying down your higher education expenses and inspiring stories about paying off student loans. We're your hosts, Daphne Vanessa and Shamil Rodriguez.

Shamil Rodriguez (00:19): Welcome to another episode of the student loan podcast. Today, we have an interesting episode for you bringing back by, well, I was going to say popular demand, but actually this is an oldie, but a goodie, Daphné and I are going to bring back, which is called start news. And what we're going to do during our start news episode is we're actually going to cover recent articles that were published related to the higher education space and share them with you. So you can stay up to date on what's been going on in student loans and higher ed. Okay. So with that being said, let's get started. Okay. The first article that we're going to be discussing is actually a change in a loan servicer. So FedLoan servicing has actually decided not to renew its contract with the federal government to service our student loans, but you might be asking him, well, what does that mean?

Shamil Rodriguez (01:11): Well, I'm not sure about you, but it's happened to me where one of my student loan servicers has actually changed hands and I had to start making payments to another company. Well, in this case, those servicing, which is one of the largest servicers out there has decided not to renew his contract, which means that by the end of this year, which is when the contract expires according to an article by Forbes and Adam Minsky, we actually are going to be seeing a transition between now and then, so that you can know if you have a FedLoan servicing account what should you expect moving forward? Another interesting part, and I think Daffy would love to hear your thoughts on this too. I didn't didn't know this, that it's also going to be impacting public service loan forgiveness, because they service those as well. And so I thought that that would be interesting because it can be a bit confusing when you think you're making a payment to one provider and then all of a sudden have to be making payments to another provider. So what are your thoughts Daphne?

Daphné Vanessa (02:12): Interesting, since they were so highly rated from a consumer protection perspective, they were one of the servicers that had the least number of complaints. And of course the bar is pretty low certain servicers and, and this is no judgment on any servicers since when you're a large company it's normal that you're probably going to get more complaints. However, FedLoan servicing was a favorite, you could say among the student loan servicing community. So it's shocking that they are no longer renewing. I was quite surprised by, by this news.

Shamil Rodriguez (02:53): Yeah, no, I agree. I agree completely. And I mean, even though you may have an account that's been serviced by them doesn't mean that these programs are just going to go away. Right. So if you have you know, if you're on track for PSLF like we've discussed with an episode with Betsy may not it doesn't mean that all of a sudden that's going to go away. It just means that you're going to have to continue your program with someone else. But something to keep in mind is to make sure that means that you're also going to have to be a little bit more proactive in the meanwhile until your account and your situation gets settled. Just don't just assume that things are going to just go very smoothly. And then all of a sudden, you know, every, all your hit and your payment history and, and anything that you set up, any plans that you set up, just don't assume that that's going to carry over to the new service loan servicer.

Shamil Rodriguez (03:44): So keep that in mind that you may have to call be a bit proactive make sure that everything that you had set up before is now set up in place at this new provider and that they're tracking all of the progress that you've made. If you're one of the students that are Sydney, if you're, if you're someone who is on track for the public service loan forgiveness program. Okay. So that's definitely something you should keep in mind is, is being proactive in that front, Daphne. Anything else before I move on to the next article?

Daphné Vanessa (04:11): No rest in peace.

Shamil Rodriguez (04:14): I know it's sad to see him go. All right. Next one I thought was a really interesting one here on the Chronicle of higher education that actually discusses major private gifts to higher education, and they actually make a great list. And we're going to include each of these articles on the show notes so that you can go ahead and take a deeper dive into these articles and see where they're, where they're going into. Especially this one I thought was really interesting because this directly impacts how much you're going to take out student loans, because as a part of the cost of tuition schools calculate typically, or at least my experience when I was on the board for a community college we calculated how much was going to come into the to the school from outside sources before calculating the cost of tuition.

Shamil Rodriguez (05:02): So that included, you know government funding you know, bequests from donors that may have passed away. Any, anything that was coming in, or just from like the foundation that's associated with the school, how much they were raising in, in, in the ability to give scholarships to students that were coming in. So all of that plays a role in the cost of tuition. So I thought this article was interesting because it breaks down publicly disclosed donations that were received and actually shows how much they were. And so I'll just list a couple of them here, Daphne Alyssa, you thought there were some other ones that you came to mind immediately. But one example back in 2018 Michael Bloomberg gave $1.8 billion for, for financial student aid or for stealing. Wow,

Daphné Vanessa (05:49): That's a good one. And I think it's important to track these because if you're following the news on where the money is going, if you haven't attended college, yet, that might help guide where you go. Since you know that now there's this pool of money in this school potentially in your area of study. So that's one reason to track these large donations. And another reason to attract these large donations is because while you are in school, if your school hasn't received a match like this or a donor like this, it's a good opportunity to get involved with the alumni office, the office of donor engagement, all of these offices to see how your university is competing with some of these larger donations and no, not everybody can receive a billion dollar donation. I completely understand that unless bill gates and Melinda gates, I guess separately now decide to be quite generous and pour them. You know what let's let's, let's, let's give it to Jeff basis. Now let's take some heat away from, from bill gates, since he's no longer number one, but, but right, these large donations can't go to everyone, but it's important to use as a benchmark for your university and start to get involved because you never know who you're going to meet as a student or graduate. And even if you don't secure additional funding for school, you'll probably meet some really cool people that might help you in your future career.

Shamil Rodriguez (07:23): Absolutely. I think it's such a great idea because a lot of people simply just don't know, or if you do know, you find out after you've graduated that these donor offices even exists at your university or school, right. You may not just put, you know, you're so focused on going to school and getting things done. Just thinking about the idea that, Hey, you know what I may want to get involved in this office or the structure of this organization that's within the university so that I can, you know, expand my network, expand my ability to receive financial aid the, all of those things we've covered before in, in the podcast it could really, really be helpful for you long-term financially, especially I could help you with your job prospects too, with your network, because these donors are successful, successful, wealthy individuals that clearly have the ability to help you move forward.

Shamil Rodriguez (08:12): If your career aligns with their with where they made their success. So it's good to keep in mind. I guess a couple others that I wanted to highlight that came, that came to mind. I also like looking at the ones that were like double, right? So people that were giving more than once to one university or Institute, I thought that was interesting. Like the California Institute of technology had received over $700 million of a contribution from Stewart and Lynda Resnick back in 2019. And then in 2001 from another foundation the Betty Moore foundation received $600 million back in 2001. That was an interesting one. And another one that had double one, which I thought, you know, people just might know because Phil Knight, the founder of Nike and his wife, penny also gave $500 million twice.

Shamil Rodriguez (09:06): Right? So back to a billion there Daphne $500 million twice once in 2016 and once in 2021. So like we said, we're going to post these in the show notes. I think it's an interesting article to peek through. What if your school was on here? You should check that out for sure. Right. There are definitely some big name schools. He made a scene here. And some other schools that, that you may not know have received some really big contributions because we had mentioned in the first one, John Hopkins had received at $1.8 billion contribution from Michael Bloomberg. But he also gave another $350 million back in 2013 to John Hopkins as well. So you have to keep in mind

Daphné Vanessa (09:46): Great, really good to keep in mind.

Shamil Rodriguez (09:49): All right. The next one what, that was an interesting one Daphne here, I think that you brought to my attention, I just didn't, didn't see this as an issue because it just wasn't on my radar. The Chronicle of higher education also covered another topic called the missing men, which was actually the gender gap amongst college students and how it worsened during the pandemic. And the question that they pose is is this even a problem that colleges are willing to tackle? So I found this one to be interesting, and it's when I was in school, this was something the, the numbers were closer to even, but women were already outpacing men. And it just seems that during the pandemic, according to this article, that especially in community colleges men were outpacing women in terms of not going to school during the pandemic.

Shamil Rodriguez (10:38): And one of the examples that they highlighted, which I thought was interesting was that because school was working moving into a remote perspective one of the anecdotes that they use was that a gentleman didn't want to, he knew he wouldn't be able to perform as well unless he was in the classroom itself and having that structure because of being at home, wasn't going to provide him the structure that he would need to be successful. So he took it upon himself before he even saw it. That was the case or not took it upon himself, not to, to enroll in school while you know, learning was online, which I found interesting. What about you Daphne?

Daphné Vanessa (11:18): I agree that it's very interesting. It's a very interesting approach, but equity should be looked at as equity, right? And so asking the question is this, even a problem is a little bit concerning because we start to group based on history instead of starting to think about just equity generally. So, so we want people to attend university because that helps ensure that a certain part of the workforce exists in years. And do we want it to be predominantly one gender or another gender? It should hopefully be more or less equal, but ensuring that is a little bit difficult when people are voluntarily saying no to college. So I would really love to see more data. I think on why men are choosing not to go to college. Is it because career options are different or they're going straight into business, or they're just not doing anything. What are the reasons that would be really interesting study? Not sure if that's within the scope of the Chronicle of higher education or not, but whoever is interested in that study, that would be a really interesting study to see why people are choosing not to go to school anymore.

Shamil Rodriguez (12:51): Yeah. It sounds like it could be definitely somebody, a PhD thesis for sure. Right,

Daphné Vanessa (12:57): Exactly. But I just want to emphasize that equity is equity for all. And we really shouldn't sort of say, oh, well, because men have done well in the past, they don't need to go to college anymore. I don't, I don't know

Shamil Rodriguez (13:13): That doesn't sit right with, but I think you're, I think you're right, especially when it comes to education, right? Because what you do with the education is up to you, right. But you should at least give yourself the opportunity to be in a position to move in different directions. And what gives you flexibility and versatility is having different skillsets. And as we've mentioned before, college may not be for every single person or at least the typical traditional path may not be exactly for everyone. But but we do believe that you should have some sort of skill set that allows for you to be dynamic in the workforce. And we think that college is one of the ways to do it. And so hopefully as they figure out why, why that might be the case or why that trend seems to be happening they can figure that out.

Shamil Rodriguez (13:59): So that the next generation of people, like definitely saying just the next generation can simply have the opportunity, because if you do it from an historical perspective, now you're just looking at people that have had the opportunity to be successful in one way or another. But then the next generation of a certain type of group that you're talking about doesn't have that same opportunity or not the same options. You just gotta keep an eye on it. And I think the best way to look at is just keep an eye on it and then see what those trends are. And as you said, once they figure it out, then they can try to address it so that they can keep that balance. And from my perspective, give people the opportunity to have the flexibility in the marketplace. That's, what's really important here.

Daphné Vanessa (14:37): Agreed. That's it's the flexibility. And another part that would be interesting not to add to somebody's thesis here, but would be to assess well, if less men are going to, what is the impact on career outcomes? What is the impact on pay? Are there still disparities in pay the, the traditional way, or I guess the way that it's presented in the media now, which is that women, et cetera, are making less than men. Is that still the case, even though less men are going to college, are men still in higher positions at companies, even though they're not going to college, like what, what is, what does the data show that the outcome is of that decrease? That would be a really interesting study. And we won't know immediately today, if the decline happens today, you won't know until people start working, obviously, but whoever's interested in writing a thesis about, I will help you get funding. So let me know, not for my personal network, but I'm saying I will help you write whatever you need to write to get funding. I think it's an interesting study.

Shamil Rodriguez (15:49): Yeah, I think so. I think there's some good underlying hopefully, and that studied that we'd be able to find some underlying themes that can be applied across sectors, not just for men that are not applying for college, but just students in general because it's impacting more than just your, your gender. Okay. All right. So let's go onto the next article here. This one is actually a direct press release by the department of education. And it's a copy of the oral statement made by the secretary of education, Miguel Cardona on the policies and priorities of the United States department of education. So this one is interesting because student loans weren't mentioned directly, but I thought another part of of the statement that I guess if I were within department of education on this podcast right now, maybe one day, you'll hear them soon. You know, I would make the point that even though student loans weren't directly mentioned by my secretary Cardona, he definitely mentioned the idea of enforcing civil rights laws related to education, to protect students and to advance equity, right.

Shamil Rodriguez (16:51): And educational opportunity. So I think that that's really important to highlight because this actually leads into another article by the press release by the department of education with the borrower defense claims. There were three institutions, so there were actually 1800 borrowed defense claims. He said, well, wait, what do you smell? What is a borough defense claim? Right. So basically bottom line up front is that 1800 people didn't have to pay back their student loans because colleges were taking advantage of them. Right. And so I think that that would be one example of how someone who works at the department of education or secretary Cardona if he ever graced to the show, we'll keep trying on that one. Would actually make the argument that even though he didn't mention student loans directly in his statement he definitely mentioned the idea of enforcing civil rights laws.

Shamil Rodriguez (17:46): And I think that's a great way to at least students or graduates that were taken advantage of by, by different colleges during their time there. So, you know, I thought that was interesting. I would have liked to have seen student loans mentioned directly. It's just such a hot topic. Especially since we're still waiting to see whether or not the administration is going to be forgiving student loans. And I think a lot of people are wondering, you know, is it going to be president Biden directly or can it come to the department of education under secretary Cardona whether it be some collaborative effort or will it be through Congress, these are all options that are still being considered. But still good to know. And we'll keep, we'll keep that on your radar to see if there are any other changes or relief that comes with the department of ed itself. That's going to impact, you know, all the student loan borrowers, especially for the federal student loans. What do you think Daphne

Daphné Vanessa (18:39): Really interesting to see something just more directly said for a statement like that with student loans being so top of mine, I would have thought that secretary Cardona would have emphasized that. But of course he has other priorities, right? We're not the only

Shamil Rodriguez (18:57): Priority for our dear

Daphné Vanessa (18:59): Friend, Miguel, just kidding. So there are other priorities of course, with the younger students, that was his space, right? When he served in Connecticut, he was not in the higher education space most immediately. So, yeah,

Shamil Rodriguez (19:20): Absolutely. And like we said, we're since, like you said, we're not the top of priority or we're not the only topic that needs to be tackled. But it's, it's out there, millennials special snowflake, you still are a special snowflake, but you're one special snowflake amongst many other special snowflakes.

Daphné Vanessa (19:40): I'm so disappointed Cardona.

Shamil Rodriguez (19:43): No, it's all good. Oh, they're working. They're working. All right. So next we have here as an article from Smith college actually from themselves announcing that a house speaker Nancy Pelosi will speak at their college. Now you might be asking yourself, well, what does that have to do with student loans? Well, this actually ties in neatly because if you want to help voice your concern. And I don't know if you've ever met someone, maybe, maybe somebody else, you know, that has complained about student loans or the government not doing anything about student loans up to you. This is not my opinion, but it's something that you can say you've may have heard before. Now this is your chance to actually help voice that opinion. And if there's a Q and a portion, especially then you'll be able to be able to voice your concern about that.

Shamil Rodriguez (20:32): Whether it's the cause of higher education, whether it's the the what's going to happen with student loans. And if Congress is going to provide some, some relief or, you know, is there going to be more support for Pell grants more support for making state schools free and affordable? It's all these things will I think will be helpful, especially because Smith college is, is, is going to be happening. She's gonna be opening the event for their a year and democracies, right. So I think, especially when we're thinking about democracy itself and education for the population being such an important role, because an educated workforce and populace is the foundation, or at least my perspective is one of the foundations of having a thriving and successful democracy. So you should definitely go out there support this event, be there to voice your opinion, especially if you have a view on, on student loans or the cost of tuition because native Felicity literally is the speaker of the house of representatives. So she's definitely here

Daphné Vanessa (21:39): What a great opportunity for Smith college.

Shamil Rodriguez (21:42): Absolutely. Absolutely. What else do you think that B sorry, I feel like I, I monopolize that, that topic there,

Daphné Vanessa (21:49): There's nothing to monopolize. I think exactly how you said it. It's a great opportunity to voice your concerns and sort of, if there's a question and answer portion speaking to the speaker of the house, Madame Nancy Pelosi would be a great opportunity. So take advantage if you are on campus or probably even nearby campus. I know some universities allow for the community to attend events like these. So if you are nearby, this is a huge opportunity. I love when elected officials stop by. Okay.

Shamil Rodriguez (22:25): Yeah, no, you're right. And I think what's great that the, what they're doing is they're actually going to also live stream as well. So I'm curious to see whether or not when they have, it's going to be on their Facebook page. Like if they're going to allow or like take questions from the audience, which is like one way that I'm sure they can interact with alumni and the general public. So that's going to be pretty interesting. All right. Next one, that I found extremely interesting that I was looking forward to bringing up here was on Forbes that recovering that there were certain higher education groups calling to stop using the sat and the act scores in his college rankings. I thought this was actually a really interesting cause there was an open letter to the editors of the U S news and world reports, right?

Shamil Rodriguez (23:13): So these are, this is the organization that, that creates these best college rankings that so many people are like stressed about and not stressed about like from the, like from the school's perspective. But so many students that are going to college from high school really look at those rankings and like use that as like the social proof that there's justification for their school. And I'm not saying it's just made up and then it's like, just something that people, it doesn't have value because there are workplaces that use these rankings to justify who they're hiring and who they're going to pursue. Right. So there is some value I put in air quotes here that people are using. But I found that it was pretty interesting that that they're, that they're actually requesting that they stopped using the practice of average, the average sat and sat scores as part of its rankings. I mean, what do you think Daphne,

Daphné Vanessa (24:09): There's been a long debate that I never thought in my lifetime. I would see get this far. I remember conversations about examinations, not actually being equitable because of the way questions were crafted. And I remember experiencing some of that, but I never thought in my wildest dreams that the conversation would get this far. So I'm really just shocked and watching from afar, because I think there's a lot of merit in both sides of the argument, but I'm really pleased that people have been open enough to have a conversation and taken action to see, well, what does an applicant pool look like if we take away these barriers that prevent people without privilege from succeeding sometimes. So it's a really interesting point. I think the most interesting point that I've heard is the fact that people of all socioeconomic classes can't afford to retake the exam.

Daphné Vanessa (25:13): And that's something that if you grew up middle-class or privileged, you're not aware that some people are really going to extreme lengths just to take an exam and you've taken it, you know, not even thinking about that. So that's such that, that to me was a really powerful point that not everybody can afford to just take the exam and it's a privilege and to have a tutor on top of that super privilege. So it's not that your kid is smarter, no offense, but that maybe if those same resources were given to a family that couldn't afford, maybe that kid would have had a shot too. And so that to me was the biggest heartbreaker, if you will, where you just realize that the situation is not the same for everybody. And so are we really making this exam equitable if people who can pay for their way to succeed, win every time?

Shamil Rodriguez (26:15): Yeah. I think that's a really great point and something else to highlight here, just for anybody who's listening, who is who's listened to more than just this episode on the podcast is that this actually was led by new America which is one of we've had a guest from their organization, a think tank in Washington DC, or I think an action tank according to their website was led excuse me, by in Washington DC. And that was episode 25 of you don't want to go listen that we had a guest on from new America Alejandro Costa that talked about data, data analytics in higher education. But the reason I bring that up is because what you're going to see is that they do a great job of listing what that one of the, or many of the ways that are, that they see as objections for why you should be continuing to use standard admission tests for grading colleges.

Shamil Rodriguez (27:08): Right? And I think another aspect that be had mentioned very greatly, how low-income students are disadvantaged, but some of the other ones that I thought were interesting as well was that, you know, SATs and HTTS don't necessarily quantify the quality of the school it mentions, or it does a great job of quantifying how selective schools are, but it doesn't necessarily predict the quality of the school. And it doesn't predict a separate one. It doesn't predict the performance of the student in college. Like Debbie had mentioned if you just had access to greater preparatory materials or schools or private tutors, right. Which can rack up the thousands of dollars, just for one tutor for one exam, you know, in terms of the lifespan of the, of the tutoring sessions that you have that just indicates how well your family can afford for you to have these, these these programs in advance of taking the test.

Shamil Rodriguez (28:03): And like Daphne said, if you didn't do well, you can retake it again. So these things are real, real impacts are real. W they have a real impact on the ability of the student, but doesn't necessarily say whether or not the school was a great school to go to. So I thought that was interesting that they're tackling it from that perspective to say, Hey us S news, you are the leader in this space of rankings. Everyone goes to you guys. We can't act like you're not the only one, but you were definitely the leader in this space. You should reconsider removing that because some schools aren't even, they're being more flexible because of the pandemic in terms of not accepting the sat scores or act scores. So if that's the case, how is it equal across the board? How are you making an apples to apple comparison from one school to another, if one school is being more flexible by not having a standardized tests in their admissions process for one reason or another, I thought that was interesting.

Shamil Rodriguez (28:57): Okay. next article to talk about here is as we're writing up the end up here is Illinois passes a law requiring its public universities to use tests, optional admissions, right. It seems to be related guys. So it actually looks like Illinois has joined Colorado, right? That requires as public universities permit students to choose whether they submit an act and an sat score when applying to public colleges and universities in the state. Right. And so what we're starting to see are like deputy said, she didn't think it would happen in our lifetimes is that flexibility to really look at other ways to allow for students to apply for their school, because it may not just be the standardized test. Now, this is not saying that you don't have to take it, but I find it interesting that they're now giving you options, right?

Shamil Rodriguez (29:48): Like they're giving students options to really highlight themselves in their strengths when they're applying for schools. And I think that having that option, that flexibility is really important because it allows for you to really highlight your strength as an individual, as you're applying for a school. I know there are schools that will, will ask you during an application process now to say, Hey, should we place more emphasis on your sat score? Or should we place more emphasis on your, your resume and your work experience, or just like your background, right? Like your service in the community. So I'm really happy to see that more states now are jumping on board, which is being more flexible in the way that they're allowing their students to apply for their public colleges and universities in their states. What do you think, Daphne? I agree,

Daphné Vanessa (30:38): Like I said, I was shocked. I am still shocked, but pleasantly pleasantly surprised is a better way of saying it because now you're going to start to see a student population that is more representative of society. The society that we live in and through that you'll then see a workforce. That's more representative of the society that we live in and maybe we'll live in a world where there's actual equity across industries. So I think this is a huge first step universities, although not everyone attends university, but universities are a very powerful force in the future of our workforce makeup. So it is very pleasant to hear that universities are going to extreme lengths. I wouldn't even say extreme, but have had thought deeply about how to be more inclusive. I think that's beautiful.

Shamil Rodriguez (31:32): Well said, well said. All right. So the last article here, Forbes just to give them a shout out, we'd have no partnership or sponsorship here, but they definitely do cover higher education in that space in a really good way. At least I liked that they're doing it. Is that the EdTech? There's an ed tech gap growing between China and the U S right. And this article, and like I said, we'll mention this in the show. We'll link these in the show notes. So you can read a read and take a deep dive yourself and read the article yourself. What was just saying that there is a growing gap in the amount of investment that's going into ed tech and what I think one of the bigger ones that stands out than in the past decade that Chinese ed tech has been nearly double the amount of the U S investment.

Shamil Rodriguez (32:22): Right. and so keeping in mind, like when you're looking at the ed tech space, they can be plenty of factors that play a role here. And I think that'd be I'd be interested to hear your perspective on this too. But you know, there, there are different spaces for it to do so it can be whether or not it's maybe there's lots of students, right. Maybe the families in China, or are more willing to spend a greater percentage of their income on their children's education, which I found interesting as well. Right. And so these, these types of things are pretty interesting because you know, online is the future of education, right? And so I mean, I just thought it was just an interesting article. I would love to see if we get any comments on that, but what do you think Daphne

Daphné Vanessa (33:09): Online is the future of education? And while there will be a little bit more pushback, the pandemic really brought to light that the internet is the future. It's how we're building our system. It's where all of our record keeping is it's where everything is. It's where our information is, is how we're learning. So there are likely going to be consequences, health consequences. I'm not saying that that the internet is perfect, but the resistance to go completely online by some schools in the U S has been interesting since it really is the future. And China's adoption of this ad tech, these ad tech platforms just shows that they're thinking about the future a lot more than some of our schools may be in the U S

Shamil Rodriguez (34:04): Yeah, I think it's interesting. I think it would be interesting to continue to observe so we can see how the differences in ed tech are changing because in America, there really is that perspective of technology providing like technology products and services to schools rather than directly to the consumer and learning themselves. Now we know that there are plenty of online platforms that allow for you to go and learn at your own pace or get certified in a specific skillset. But I am interested to see how this changes the game for everyone, so to speak because education is changing and it's going to impact student loans, because if you're able to go to a, or pursue a higher career by simply learning what you need to learn online without having to pay for a four year school, that changes the game big time.

Shamil Rodriguez (34:57): That's something to keep in mind. So we'll keep you included on that as we do future start news episodes but was really happy to go over that. I cover some of those news that's happening. And if you've got any comments or feedback or other topics that you think we should cover in future episodes, you can do so by sending us a DM or, you know, tagging us on Twitter or Instagram at start Stardew, if you wanted it to there, or the suit alone podcast, you can message us directly. You can message email me directly at Shamila star, new.com and Daphne at Daphne Sr, new.com. So definitely before we wrap up anything else you wanted to mention on today's podcast so much?

Daphné Vanessa (35:37): I want to mention, but I will save it for the next episode when we see you guys next week.

Shamil Rodriguez (35:43): Okay. All right. That would, that being said, make sure that you rate review, right. And subscribe to this podcast. And one great favor. I would love to ask for you, if you don't mind, if you know someone that could benefit from this, maybe someone who is sending their kid to school, or maybe that someone who's going to school themselves and you think they could learn from one of these episodes, send them a copy of, of this in a text message, just send the link or send them, just let them know what the name of the podcast is. Because that's what we're trying to do. We're trying to impact the most people that we can. And we can't do that without your help. And we really appreciate all the support that we received so far. We're really excited about this, this podcast, and we look forward to continuing to see it grow. So for more information on today's episode, visit the student loan podcast.com forward slash episode 37. That's the student loan podcast.com forward slash episode 37.